January 30th, 2012 
gunsage 
Skyrim has hit most gamers’ Game of the Year for 2011, if not their personal top 10 list. In saying that, I must admit it’s one of the finest games I’ve ever played. There are a few problems, however, that could have been ironed out to make the game even more fantastic and unfortunately these problems, while ranging from mildly annoying to sort of annoying, culminate to create frustration in a game that is otherwise flawless. Things like…
Lacking In Mystery
I don’t feel like I’m ruining things here for Oblivion, especially since it’s a 2006 title, but if you haven’t played it and really want to, you may as well skip this point. In Oblivion, it wasn’t too terribly easy to figure out how to gain entrance to “secret society” archetype guilds like the thieves guild or the assassins guild. And really, that makes sense. Actually, I ended up having to scout an FAQ to figure out the assassins guild one.
The thieves guild wasn’t as difficult. All you have to do is talk to the right homeless people and you start acquiring info that eventually leads you to where you want to be. But in Skyrim? “HI HI HI, THIS IS DA THIEVES TOWN WHERE THIEVES ARE AND I HEARD A RUMOR THEY’RE IN THE SEWERS BUT IT’S ONLY A RUMOR ACTUALLY.” Yeah. Subtle. Oh, but hey, at least it’s hard to figure out how to get into the assassins guild, right? Right?
Wrong. You have a mission that’s delivered to you by some random means where someone wants to call upon the wrath of the assassins guild and you just happen to get the call…but you’re not a member. Easy to figure out. Easy to do. Stupidly simple. Now you might link this in with puzzling elements saying they’re trying to make it more casual, but come on. If you REALLY want to be a thief and/or assassin, shouldn’t this be more, I don’t know…INTERESTING?
Levelling Up Is Too Subtle
I like subtlety. Games like Shining Force Neo make this fun because allocating just a few points into something won’t be the difference between a deathblow and missing the enemy entirely, but it will, over time, account for something grand. Unfortunately, Skyrim plays this hand with such subtlety it may as well not exist. As a side note, I WAS trying to be a master thief first and foremost, so it may just be that I didn’t notice immediate gains for that reason, but I digress.
The first 10 levels, it seemed like nothing was truly improving. Sure, I was technically getting stronger, more adept, etc. from a numbers angle, but there was no noticeable gameplay difference, especially because of level scaling. Worse still, so you’d go “Ah shit, I’m really getting raped in the HP department. That does it. When I level up, I’m working on light armor and improving my HP!”
Yeah okay…only you’d still be getting screwed over anyway. The change is so subtle it’s unnoticeable. In fact, I didn’t start noticing major gains until probably in the 30s or 40s of character level. Granted, I’m level 54 now and I rarely die anymore, but the bottom line is there’s a point at which, especially if you’re trying to dedicate yourself to a certain class, you get totally screwed over regularly because you’re not really training yourself as a warrior and the level scaling suddenly jumps out of nowhere.
Mountains
One of my biggest gripes about Oblivion is trying to climb mountains. Often you’d have to work on your acrobatics skill, constantly jumping, and hope you find those few “sweet spots” that actually allow you to progress upward rather than sideways until you find your way up. Oh, and THEN when you finally do find your way up, you find a very clear pathway down that you didn’t find AT ALL when humping the entire perimeter of the mountain for about an hour. FUN.
At least there weren’t many mountains in Oblivion and at least in the new Fallout games there are rarely mountains at all, but SKYRIM IS ALL ABOUT FUCKING MOUNTAINS. You know, they took out various “redundant” abilities like acrobatics…why not replace them with a climbing skill? Maybe just have it where you can get climbing gear and over time it will break, but if you have a higher skill, strength value overall, etc., then it won’t break as often and you’ll move faster or something.
Seriously, what the hell where they thinking? The environments are fucking beautiful, but JEEZ. Navigating these mountains and finding new areas is often a chore because the landscaping is done…well…but not well enough to allow for actually showing the way properly. The same goddamn thing happens as in Oblivion, but constantly, and worse because there’s no acrobatic ability. FUCKING FUCK.
Quest Items Suck
In my inventory I have quest items that I can’t drop, stow away, or sell. Alright, that makes sense. You wouldn’t want a situation where you accidentally did away with something important and totally jeopardized a task, side mission or not. No, that does make sense. WHAT DOESN’T MAKE SENSE is often these have an associated weight, often glitch, and sometimes have a highly unnecessary value.
I’ve got various quest items I can’t get rid of, but there’s a weight for them? The fuck? And it wouldn’t be so bad, but the missions for a lot of these have technically been completed, but the item was never removed, so it’s a constant hindrance for no reason other than derp game design. And again, there’s a value associated with it? Why? I can’t sell them even if I was totally hard up.
Oh, and it gets better. There are certain quests that, despite the fact I’ve completed all the objectives, didn’t roll over to complete, cancelled out, or to a new objective…meaning they’re just taking up space. Not nearly as annoying as the quest items themselves, but an annoyance all the same. When you’re looking at a game this close to perfect, even the smallest speck doesn’t go unnoticed.
Nearly Impossible To Not Be A Warrior
What is an RPG? Depending on who you ask it could be an epic journey, a game that involves a lot of strategy and planning, a game that focuses heavily on story, a game that focuses even heavier on grinding and character development, and/or a game that’s all about beating the shit out of monsters to gain experience and level up, which allows you to beat the shit out of stronger monsters easier without getting the shit beat out of yourself quite so easily.
Really, I’d say it’s a healthy combination of everything, but the Elder Scrolls series has always been a little…different. It’s not entirely combat centered. There are MANY ways to level up and all of them are useful. Or they were. Until Skyrim. Let me be frank…if you go into this game attempting to be a master thief, you are going to fail, fail, and fail again in order to accomplish this.
Any guild will have you doing the same thing. Go here. Kill this. Come back. While the thieves guild is supposed to be about non-violence, the ideas are still similar in nature. Effectively, if you’re not already on your way to being a master thief by the time you choose this guild, you will not succeed. Oh, but that’s okay, BECAUSE THE TRIP TO RIFTEN ALONE WILL TURN YOU INTO A MONSTER TESTICLE WEARING WARRIOR OF INSANITY ANYWAY.
Conclusion
Skyrim is a game for warriors. If you do not set out initially to be a warrior, there will be a point at which the game becomes difficult enough that it becomes annoying. You will evade dragons. You will focus only on stupid non-combat shit you can to level up, just so you can add perks to something that IS combat related and probably your max HP so MAYBE…just maybe…you won’t get a cornholing the next time you enter that cave to JUST STEAL SHIT OR WHATEVER BUT END UP HAVING TO FIGHT SHIT BECAUSE HOOOOOLY SHIT THAT’S WHAT THIS GAME IS ALL ABOUT, ACTUALLY.
And yet, I fucking love this game. It can feel unbalanced and unfair at times, but it’s totally worth sticking with. Hell, I just love rolling over achievements, completing quests, and levelling up. It’s still fun, even 100 hours in. And if I’m 100 hours in, then you know that these are still minor gripes. Seriously, if you don’t own this game, you fucking suck. Go get it!
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You are stupid as hell.
yeah haha easy for warriors? range and mage are so powerful in skyrim
A lot of this stuff is just bitching. The first 2 points I understand. But the mountain point is just to complain. The quest items stuff is also just complaining. The quest items you can't get rid of have a weight, but it doesn't actually count towards your encumbrance. And I successfully created a master thief, and used stealth skills on nearly every questline except for the Companions, which is the warrior guild, and the civil war.
Yeah, no. The mountain point is a valid point. At no point has Bethesda ever made a game where you could successfully traverse mountainous territory successfully unless you find that one little obscured path, which is often not well marked or found. Quest items do count toward your encumbrance and it doesn't make sense why some of them have an assigned value. It would've made more sense to have a separate area for quest items that would have sectioned them off from normal items, which has been done in JRPGs for 20+ years.
Furthermore, the road to Riften is fucking tough and meant for a warrior, yet it's a town of thieves. It's a clear contradiction. You're telling me you want to be a thief, so I'm going to throw this incredibly dangerous road full of tough ass enemies at you. Good job, designers. The game was clearly centered around being a warrior or warrior mage with being a thief as an afterthought.
Okay time for my two cents. First I never had any issue with encumbrance Given how many houses you can own and shops there are, your point on quest items counting towards weight really doesn't make much sense to me. For 20 years western RPG's have forced you to deal with that for the most part. It's a simple process of traveling to town and storing/selling shit you don't need at that moment. If there was no quick travel in the game I might be more willing to agree with you.
Ah the mountain issue and the mass whining that goes with it. I am sorry, but if it's a Bethesda game, then your going to have to deal with shitty terrain. It's been that way forever. Sure there was not as many mountains in Oblivion, but there was still terrain that was a nightmare to climb. Even more so in Morrowwind. As far as the series goes Skyrim is about the same. I personally take satisfaction at finding obscure routes up stuff and I never worried about acrobatics or whether I was good at jumping. Both Fallout and Elder Scrolls have been like this. That doesn't mean you have to like it, but there is plenty of precedent for it in Bethesda's other games.
I didn't know anyone actually tried to plays as a true class in the Elder Scrolls games. I sure don't and not because the designers don't love X class. I honestly don't think any solo class was given all that much love and that is what I like about the game. I don't have to be just a thief or a mage or a warrior. I can be a combination of all three. That in my mind is what makes the game even better. There plenty of RPG's that made you stick to one class and made it a nightmare to be a thief. These days I prefer RPG's that give me more options to create a unique character and Skyrim does.
I also don't think the designers centered the game around warriors. It just feels that way because sheer brute force is always going to be the easiest way to destroy an enemy. From what I can tell and mind you I have only put 130 hours or so into Skyrim. It all comes down to how much patience you want to have with a particular enemy or group of enemies. Okay so maybe that was a little more than my two cents. Anyone got change?
You know, saying that someone shouldn't complain about something because it's how it's always been done is a fallacy. I agree that it's annoying. I also understand that Bethesda isn't about to change it, doesn't make it any less annoying though.
The main way to deal with the mountains though? Buy a horse.
Personally, I'd rather go through the mountains, but Bethesda didn't think about mining skills. >:(
With horses though, they are fucking stupid and charge INTO a fight with a dragon as soon as you get off to kill it…And you shouldn't have to run away just to keep your horse alive…and even if you do try running away to save your fucking horse, the dragon just owns your ass with it's ice/frost breath.
And I don't know if anyone else has a problem with it, but every time I start a game and get Shadowmere, he ends up disappearing within a few hours of playing. Loading a previous save before he disappears every 5 minutes works only so many times before you just want to tell the game to fuck itself and throw your controller through your TV/monitor.
But one great thing about Riften, is if you get busted stealing in another certain town (Riverwood I believe it was) you get sent to Mistveil Keep.
So you can avoid the entire path to Riften simply by going to jail.
As for being a warrior in this game, what I hate is that there is really no way to fight a dragon without pulling out a bow or constantly using potions/spells to heal yourself every two sword swipes. I understand them wanting dragons to be tough to defeat for warriors, but damn, a warrior class player shouldn't have to change the difficulty setting or wait until they have all of the fighting/armour perks capped before trying to take one on with a set of swords (or even sword/shield)
Dude you could just use 20 of your coins and buy a wagon to get you there.
I read this post fully on the topic of the comparison of newest and earlier technologies,
it’s remarkable article.
i am currently playing a level 38 orc with maxed archery and maxed sneak, locking picking and other stealth skills aren't far behind. guess i'm a successful theif, huh?
You are indeed a successful "theif."
You're just a glass half-empty type of person, who would listen to you? You skip over all the towering achievements in Skyrim and go straight to obscure things that take you a paragraph to explain, then you complain about it… The thing about your complaining though is that something is either too easy or too hard. You can't just watch a movie of your perfect imagination where you control everything with a single thought and there are no challenges unless you want a challenge. It's too easy to find secret societies, but its too difficult to travel terrain? Instead of focusing how they could improve or change gameplay elements, you're off bitching about the level of difficulty. There is a difficulty adjustment by the way… Also, you don't have to be a warrior. You don't have to spend any perks and you can beat the game. Or just damage them perfectly fine with magic. I think you just don't know how to play and aren't educated in the literacy of games.
Wow, apparently you didn't read the article at all. Here are the first two sentences. Now, take it nice and slow…I wouldn't want you to get a headache.
"Skyrim has hit most gamers’ Game of the Year for 2011, if not their personal top 10 list. In saying that, I must admit it’s one of the finest games I’ve ever played."
Skyrim is an incredible game, but it has its faults. Yeah, I'm a pessimist, but I still liked the game and even said so right in the first paragraph. Instead of concentrating on the literacy of games, how about you concentrate on literacy in general and actually read the article?
I've barely engaged in combat as an assassin…I tend to insta kill everything with my sniper rif…er…longbow so I don't really get the ''Skyrims is for warriors'' thing…
waht about all of the bad ass awesome stuff bout skyrim you forgot to mention?
Because it's an article about what's wrong in the game, not a review.
I think you've made some good points here. I also find it highly annoying that I have items for completed quests that won't go away. I preferred Oblivion style where once the item was used for its intended purpose it was removed from your inventory, or you were allowed to sell it off/drop it/stow it away. Whether or not it adds towards encumbrance or not…I have to be honest I've never paid attention. I don't carry much at any given time, so I rarely pay attention to adding up every single pound in my inventory. Where it DOES piss me off is when I'm cleaning out my inventory and trying to sort out my belongings, and have to consistently scroll over something that reminds me I'm carrying worthless junk. Annoying.
And I feel you on the necessity for warrior class characters. Now granted, I tend to lean towards barbarian warriors regardless of the game I'm playing. What can I say, I'm the kinda gal who likes my characters dumb as a box of rocks but with muscles big enough to crush an enemy's skull with my bare hands….sexy. However, I normally get bored of my characters after about 30 levels, and I'll take a break by doing something very concept-oriented. For example, my second character is a wood elf who I wanted to play along the strict archer, with no melee combat and a high level of sneak. Getting to and from cities as this type of character when you are under level 10: EXTREMELY DIFFICULT. Now granted, that's realism and I'm sure characters with no combat experience in real life would be hard pressed to have an easy outside journey. And once dragons come into the mix…..come on. I hate magic, I'm not a mage and I hate anything that has to do with spell casting. Taking down a dragon as a pure melee combat veteran with no ranged experience…suck ass.
It's really awesome to hear someone articulate themselves upon the topic of this article who doesn't sound like a bot, or fanboy/girl. I do actually agree with most of your sentiments, and as a member of the WPO crew, endorse this criticism as thought-out!
I can relate to the issues around weight of items. Being a packmule, I've hoarded too much at this point, that I have rid myself of that compulsion to take everything. 🙂
I went with a Redguard archer that uses companions and conjured elementals and haven't looked back. Lockpick, sneak, and speech have helped me manipulate the politics of the story. When this game ends, it will be a sad day.
There are things that I hate though. The quick weapon switch function locks up often. The map system takes two steps to get to the map. The loading time kills me… ends game sessions often. Once in a while I find myself tackling a ridiculously powerful enemy that takes some strategy and sneaky saving tricks (wait, I don't hate that, I like the challenge). Overall, this game is fantastic. I've wasted hundreds of hours of my life with a smile on my face outside of all the criticisms. Most games are WAY shorter. If you want to talk value for hours versus price, it's a winner.
Nonetheless, Gunsage knows the score… as does OutRAGme985. This site is about the love of videogames, and fuck me, I love this game.
After all these bad stuff about Skyrim I still love this game and I can't even go to bed without finishing 1 mission.
Oh, no doubt. It's a great game, which is why any little minor point (and these really are minor points) become glaring flaws. It's not unlike dust on a diamond.
Yup, can't go to bed without finishing a mission or two 😀
the Guilds point, worrier point, and the quest items point are all valid,. and the mountains? atleast make mountain climbing gear, and make armor and swords break for gods sake! atleast make the player manage his equipment well. the guilds also need to be harder, i just complete a bunch of missions and within a day i'm the leader of the guild, and the dark brotherhood wasnt even dark or gloomy, the thieves guild said their not about violence and yet have me kill people. wtf?
no its possible to not be a warrior. I'm a wood elf hunter assassin, now where is the warrior in that name
I'm a knight elf mohawk. Where is the warrior in that name.
Your a dumbass. Mountains are awesome and your a coward. The game is about being a warior.
Grammar is your friend.
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There are some points I agree with, such as the quest items and completed quests them selves still having them in your quest log unable to complete. The warrior bit not so much I play more stealth Conj/illu. Summon Bow and when things get hairy calm and rage. Worked fine for me I think I've died only once or twice throughout the whole game, lvl 52.
ya about the it's a game for warriors thing… I hardly ever actually have to fight anyone. Ever. I just sneak up and snipe them. Aaaannnd with saying that the guilds just have you go kill people all the time…. I've found that's just the assassins guild, which is, you know, what assassins do. I haven't had to kill all that many people with the thieves guild. Mostly stealing things (which is what thieves do) so the guilds are pretty close to their names. Not just killing people. Just clarifying that little lie you told.
Err, no. Clearly you haven't played entirely through the thieves guild. I have. There was no little lie told. But hey, thanks for playing.
Minor gripes – imperfections on a diamond to be sure. The game gets rave reviews, so it's OK to point out a few gripes. Easy, people, easy. Gunsage said he loves it a bunch too.
As far as gripes, I agree with one of the above posters: you wander into town, can hardly avoid joining a guild, and you are quickly crowned the new ruler of aforementioned organization. Kinda silly.
The other thing that makes me crazy is that I'm carrying or storing junk that I can't sell. I go into town, see 3 different shop owners (load to enter, load to leave) and can only sell 2 or 3 things to each. What the heck??? Are these shopkeepers flat broke all the time? And it's not like they have one blasted thing I want to buy! I end up buying more arrows just so I can sell off a heavy piece of ebony armor.
Perhaps I'm mistaken, but I don't think Gunsage means you have to be "warrior" class; only that you couldn't complete the game as a pure non-violent sneak thief or conjurer. You gotta get in there and fight. Not that I agree with this as a gripe because it's kinda the whole point of the game. You are supposed to kill stuff. A lot.
As a contributor to this site, and someone who has NOT finished the game, yet found a way to invest about 500 hours into it… Yeah. Nitpicking. We do that here! Great counter points. Sage?
I was basically trying to point out that it's like trying to find imperfections in Chrono Trigger. You'd have to dig and they would sound like mindless bitching because, hey, it's an incredible game. The thing is these are things that were glaringly obvious to me over time because they're things I pay attention to. Despite that, the game is incredible overall and these points may be unnoticeable to some as a result, but annoy me because I was actually able to find them.
hey im thinking of buying skyrim. i search up all the good things about skyrim and the bad thing so can u guy give me suggestions. thx
Yes. Buy it. If you liked the recent Fallout games or Elder Scrolls, you can't go wrong.
yeah pretty much the people who say its a game for warriors, wow. raped this game sideways as an archer/thief. hardly used any magic or any sort of warrior type fighting (i'm guessing you're referring to the hack and slashness of the game). it is entirely possible to beat this game any way you want. i've always personally thought that the path of a warrior in any sort of title of a game was easier. higher HP, armored like crazy, and a giant weapon that destroys people, i mean come on. there's no skill involved in that. but sneaking and figuring out ways to outsmart enemies is totally different. i think you suffer from lack of dedicated brain power and lack the ability to think about more than one scenario at a time.
and yes the game is a little easy, bethesda could have made it harder to find the thieve's guild or whatever, but then there would be people griping about that as well. it's a video game, and it's intended to be quirky and kind of weird, all elder scrolls games are that way, so who gives a damn about climbing mountains or whatever.
anyways, its a good game, just like the rest of em.
It is totally possible to finish the game without being a warrior. I've always been the type to be a mage or a class that involved magic. Warriors tend to just… Attack. no real planning or strategies. This can be good and bad, but with high health and armor, strategy isn't one of the first things that come to mind with warriors. As a thief or mage, you have to plan and use strategies. Rather than charging into battle, you think what you're going to do, how, and when. I went with a thief this time, and I did notice my abilities go up by a steady rate. Also… You also have to keep in mind the time setting. The shops are shops. Not a Walmart or a Kmart with tons of money. It's only acceptable that they don't have that much money. As for the mountains… I don't think it would be realistic if you could walk up a mountain like that. xD